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Discussion: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion

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amy_c	Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 5 2010, 2:55 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 5 2010, 2:56 PM EDT Let's discuss "The Suitcase" here after it airs! Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you? Keyword tags: None
MaXimillian10	1. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 5 2010, 10:55 PM EDT Holy mackeral ! That was messy, gut wrentching. I've never seen anything like it. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?
Greg1835	2. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 12:37 AM EDT Sorry to always post a lot but every episode is just that terrific. Was this great or what?? SO.... we begin with 2 men needing Peggy. And neither in the way a woman wants to be needed or wanted. Duck is inventing the idea of a "marriage" in order to woo the girl. Don is needing her for reasons of utility. Peggy is needed by two men who are drunk. And she is also needed by her lame boyfriend, for reasons other than her. Everyone wants a piece of Peggy from Duck, to Don, to her boyfriend and family, to the new creepy art director, to her new artsy friends who don't care about her work. But she's never wanted in the way anyone would want to be wanted. Is Peggy going to be the next to crack? Is the idea of cracking a theme this year? Peggy finally did crack a little, in the fact that she cried in the women's room like we thought she'd never do. Then, Don cracks as well. There seemed to be another theme of marriage and avoidance. Don looks at his pic with Anna, which in position and posture is close to the idea of a wedding pic. He doesn't call Cali. Peggy has the guy dining with the family, and she is clearly avoiding him and it. Don and Peggy are both avoiding, yet together. Peggy after the whole season so far away from the old guard, is now for once in with the old guard in the old guard way here with Don. She's still searching for her identity. They decide to tie themselves to work in order to avoid. They're both avoiding personal responsibility when it comes to relationships. They're both avoiding metaphors with marriage. Yet they engage in a marriage of sorts when they argue like a married couple in that heated moment. That almost vicious argument was more analogous to couple fighting than work fighting. But, they end up tying themselves to each other. They tie their hand together at the end regardless. Post reply 3 out of 3 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Greg1835	3. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 12:38 AM EDT Suitcases are about travel yet they both stay home, yet away from home. Another Mad Men exploration of the idea of 3 in the idea of there are 3 kinds of suitcases. Similar to the idea of 3 classes of people we saw in the Kentucky Derby episode last year, among other examples of the idea of 3 we have seen before. Another idea of 3 is that we found out Don really did visit her in the hospital, and they're bonded in that way; and Pete has a place in each of them in Pete's knowing of what she did, and Pete's knowing what Don did regarding Korea. Again like a couple, they not only fight, but they bond as well. Don tells her about growing up on a farm, his Dad, Uncle Mack, Korea etc. He never does this. But he does now, with Peggy. Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
Greg1835	4. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 12:39 AM EDT In the very end, she sleeps on the couch in the office, just like we've seen Don time and time again. And in talking over the account at the end, did you notice she critiques him in the same way he critiques everyone? Their whole thing is backward. The whole episode begins as a metaphor of a marriage and obligation and frustration, and yet ends up as a first date if you think about it. It's backwards. They begin with the necessary evils and obligations and arguing, and end with the fun and interest and innocence of a first date. Their night ends with his head innocently in a knowing girl's lap. That's all the man wants even though he probably doesn't know it yet. But then maybe he does, gently taking her hand similar to the pilot episode when she took his. In the pilot she did so because she thought it was her duty and thought it was right. But here Don does so because it's right and more importantly because he wants to, and something he should have and did not in fact do, with Allison. Did Mr. Draper learn? One of the basic motifs of the show is lines drawn and differences. They have a line drawn between them in their differences, yet like anything that spins around and around that eventually comes back where it began ( I feel another motif of the show but that's just me), they time to time come together just for a brief moment. His taking her hand, I was reminded of the U2 song "One" with the line, "We're one but we're not the same" Post reply 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
amy_c	5. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 12:55 AM EDT Don opened up so much to Peggy and I loved that he told her to leave the door open when she left. Then, we hear a lovely Simon and Garfunkel song. Does this mean that Don will start to be more honest and open with people. Subsequently, would he be more happy that way? I agree with Maximillian -- this was gut wrenching! I felt like I had been crying for an hour at a funeral or something. Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
MaXimillian10	6. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 5:50 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 6 2010, 5:50 AM EDT "Was this great or what??" I don't know how they do it ! Just when you think it can't get anymore interesting, somehow they manage to top themselves. I knew Anna's loss would hit Dick very hard, at any time, but particularly now. Peggy's loyalty held him together. Mark Moses showing up drunk like that ? I don't know how the producers tollerate it ! Err,,ahhh, am I losing my grasp on reality ,,,? ;0) This series, restores my faith in the concept of television entertainment, It blows me away,. I wouldn't have thought it possible. Astonishing ! M Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
MaXimillian10	7. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 6:09 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 6 2010, 6:12 AM EDT "I felt like I had been crying for an hour at a funeral or something." I rate this episode alongside S1-13 as among the finest dramatic moments ever captured on TV. A watershed episode. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?
MaXimillian10	8. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 6:25 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 6 2010, 6:49 AM EDT So much to absorb and talk about. Greg covers several points, with some great commentary. We also learned a lot more about Bert Cooper, Roger's way, and how he's in a sense just as adrift as everyone else is. Then there's Duck. Brilliant acting by Mark Moses. They cover a landmark event that heralded the ascent of an icon in Mohammed Ali. Every single moment is jammed packed. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?
MaXimillian10	9. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 6:39 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 6 2010, 5:04 PM EDT Did you notice that the apparition of Anna, carried a suitcase. As if going on a trip. Nice touch. That was the defineing moment of the episode. The message had nothing to do with Sampsonite, and yet had everything to do with it, and was built around that in a most clever way. The writers, the cast, direction, photography, sound, editing, every second, every line, every shot, hits the mark. Do you rekon Don kept Peggy late in the office deliberately, on purpose because he knew what was coming ? And that he'd need help to get through the night ? She was about the only one he could turn to. Roger maybe a close friend, but it's very different. It's good to see Don interact with Peggy at the end in a true and pure sense of love and friendship, without the sexual overtone. In a sense the the same way he regarded Anna. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?
amy_c	10. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 6 2010, 3:53 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 6 2010, 3:53 PM EDT "Do you rekon Don kept Peggy late in the office deliberately, on purpose because he knew what was coming ? And that he'd need help to get through the night ? She was about the only one he could turn to. Roger maybe a close friend, but it's very different. " Yes, I think Don was definitely stalling because he didn't want to make the call. Plus, he seems to get harder on Peggy and the others when his life gets more and more out of control. When the rest of his life is falling to pieces, at least he can be THE Don Draper at work. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
makeitadouble	11. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 7 2010, 9:57 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 7 2010, 9:57 AM EDT Do you rekon Don kept Peggy late in the office deliberately, on purpose because he knew what was coming ? And that he'd need help to get through the night ? She was about the only one he could turn to. Don surely used Peggy as a substitute wife and as an excuse to not call California for the bad news on Anna. Even though Peggy is still seething over Glo-coat and the Clio's, she chooses Don over her boyfriend and family at the cost of her relationship. When Don breaks down after the phone call to Stephanie, Peggy awakes to a broken down Don. When he tells her that he just lost the only person in the world that really knows him, Peggy tenderly says that's not true. Without benefit of Don's secret past, she feels that she now truly knows the real Don Draper. AND, how about Blankenship?? I must admit that her very racist remark made me belly laugh. She's pure gold! Duck's urge to leave Don a special package was shockingly hilarious! If Don were sober, he would have kicked Duck's ass! I agree that this was a special episode and my favorite so far this season! Post reply 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you find this valuable? Do you?
amy_c	12. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 7 2010, 3:45 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 7 2010, 3:47 PM EDT To be fair, I don't think she was too crazy about the boyfriend anyway. She is just pulling a Don by doing what is expected of her. He started a loveless marriage and had three kids without his heart really being in it. I hope she doesn't do the same thing. The boy seems so nice and she's just in a different place right now. Yes, I laughed when Blankenship made that comment, too! So bad. Oh, and she was a bit promiscuous back in the day? shudder I was surprised when Don just went limp on the ground and said, "Uncle" when Duck pinned him. He's really just an empty shell these days. Maybe he and Peggy can forge a healthy friendship that can help them both. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
MaXimillian10	13. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 7 2010, 5:42 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 7 2010, 5:42 PM EDT "how about Blankenship??" "Joan knew exactly what I needed, and make sure that I got it."* *DD Post reply Do you find this valuable?
superhero50	14. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 8 2010, 7:46 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 8 2010, 7:46 PM EDT Great episode. It is still six years before the publication of “The Female Eunuch” and still longer before the term “Glass Ceiling” will be used. Peggy is surrounded by expectations she will marry and have a family “You know – 26 is still very young”. Later Draper asked her about her lost baby “Do you ever think about it?” Peggy replied: “I try not to. But then it comes up out of nowhere – playgrounds”. However she is a career girl. The reason she stays to help Draper on the Samsonite campaign is that she thinks it’s important. She loves her job but is confused by feelings that she shouldn’t - “I know what I’m supposed to want but – it just never feels right – or as important as anything in that office.” It is the dawn of female liberation and poor little Peggy probably dreams she can “have it all”! Post reply Do you find this valuable?
xoot	15. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 9 2010, 12:56 AM EDT I think this was the best episode of the entire series. In terms of the hero's journey, it seems like Don has reached rock bottom and has come through the other side with a better understanding of himself. One thing I can't work out - what did the mouse and the cockroach symbolise? Is it something to do with being out of control? Post reply Do you find this valuable?
superhero50	16. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 9 2010, 2:35 AM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 9 2010, 2:35 AM EDT "One thing I can't work out - what did the mouse and the cockroach symbolise? Is it something to do with being out of control?" I think the roach was just a joke - you need some relief. As far as the mouse goes - I wonder if everything has to be a symbol. The episode basically consisted of Don's and Peggy's stories running in parallel and meeting in sweet harmony. Everything else that happened just made up the environment in which these stories passed through. The mouse just appeared - and the characters reacted according to their own rule, Peggy jumped on a chair (just like a girl) and Don took the opportunity to procrastinate about the phone call some more. It made for a plot point as well. When Don realized that the mouse could enter and leave at will he decided to go get dinner. Anyway: the thing that I want to know is - after Don's fight with Duck - why was Peggy apologising? Was she feeling responsible for Ducks behaviour? Post reply Do you find this valuable?
BevAnneS	17. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 9 2010, 3:12 PM EDT \| Post edited: Sep 9 2010, 3:12 PM EDT Once again I have a little nagging in the back of my head about a Samsonite ad that featured an elephant and a mouse, but can't quite put my finger on it. I can't even recall if it was a TV or print ad. This time eBay was not helpful in my quest, but I'm going to keep searching. Post reply Do you find this valuable?
MaXimillian10	18. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 10 2010, 11:15 AM EDT "The mouse just appeared - and the characters reacted according to their own rule" Interesting speculation. Perhaps most telling was Don's remark, I paraphrase from memory; "there has to more than one way, in and out of here." One could infer a metaphor for his overall predicament. Good stuff. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?
MaXimillian10	19. RE: Episode 4.07 "The Suitcase" Discussion Sep 10 2010, 11:19 AM EDT "Once again I have a little nagging in the back of my head about a Samsonite ad that featured an elephant and a mouse" Which company was it, that used a gorlilla tossing thier luggage around. Clever inference, to clliche, fair, or unfairly attributed to bagage handlers at your local airport. No offese, to anyone, if you should happen to be involved, or married, engadged in such for a living. M Post reply Do you find this valuable?

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